$1.50 NL HE MTT: Does Villain always have an A here?

[tzuriel]

Game

Hold'em

Game Format

No Limit

Table Format

MTT

Buy-in

1.50

Currency

$

Been seriously card dead for about 20 hands in this micro 1.65 MTT. First defendable hand from the BB. 3 other players to the flop which hits me. I check/called flop here but should I be raising? And the A on the turn I figured that hits him when he bets big and he floated something like AK, AQ, AJ. Was there a better way to play this?


NL Holdem $1.50+$0.15 (190.00BB)
HJ (57.1BBs)
CO (33.3BBs)
BTN (78.8BBs) [VPIP: 48.7% | PFR: 25.6% | AGG: 16.2% | Hands: 39]
SB (15BBs)
HERO (52.2BBs)
UTG (74.1BBs) [VPIP: 29.4% | PFR: 23.5% | AGG: 33.3% | Hands: 18]
EP (33.2BBs)
MP (59.5BBs) [VPIP: 41.2% | PFR: 29.4% | AGG: 16.7% | Hands: 17]

Dealt to Hero: T♣ Q♦

UTG Raises To 2.6BBs, EP Folds, MP Calls 2.5BBs, HJ Folds, CO Folds, BTN Calls 2.5BBs, SB Folds, HERO Calls 1.5BBs

Hero SPR on Flop: [4.29 effective]
Flop (11.6BBs): 6♠ 5♥ T♠
HERO Checks, UTG Bets 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 67.6BBs), MP Folds, BTN Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 72.4BBs), HERO Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 45.8BBs)

Turn (23BBs): 6♠ 5♥ T♠ A♦
HERO Checks, UTG Bets 11.5BBs (Rem. Stack: 56.1BBs), BTN Folds, HERO Folds

Spoiler

UTG wins: 23BBs

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
Normally QTo is a defend against this open sizing, but when the open is from UTG, and two other players have called, I think, we can just let it go. The problem is, that even when we flop top pair, there are still many ways for us to be behind or get drawn out on later, and we are going to be out of position.

Flop
This is exactly the problem. You flopped top pair, so it feels to tight to fold. But you dont even have top kicker or a BDFD, and UTG is betting into 3 people. He should not be doing a lot of bluffing, and if he has a made hand, its almost always better than yours. And you also need to worry about, what BTN has. So yeah as played I would also call here, but how often are you actually going to win this hand? This is just something to think about, and it points back to, why you can save yourself a lot of headache by just folding pre.

Turn
UTG should actually not be C-betting into 3-players with just A high, so this card dont hit him as much, as you think, or at least it should not. But he is betting half pot, after two players called him on the flop, so he is showing a lot of strength. Maybe he has AT or AX of spades, or maybe he flopped a set. Whatever it is, he most likely have QT beat, and you are still only on the turn, so I would also fold and save my chips for a better spot.

Conclusion
Perfect illustration of, why its better to just fold pre, even though it looks like, you are getting a good price. As played pre postflop is fine.

 

[AKQ]

The UTG definitley has AKs in his range
2.6 preflop raise
1/3 cbet on a missed board

then the ace hits and the villians bets 2/3 the pot

id bet an ace or a set

 

[D0nk3y Hunt3r]

I would bet this on flop to check what's going on. There are slim chances to check it out to the river.

 

[spunka]

the Checks makes you look weak, he's bet is protecion against you might be on a draw..
question is why do you not bet the top pair on the flop ? or even better reraise on flop

 

[fundiver199]

the Checks makes you look weak, he's bet is protecion against you might be on a draw..
question is why do you not bet the top pair on the flop ? or even better reraise on flop

It is pretty standard to check to the preflop aggressor. Donk betting this hand into 3 opponents would be an overplay, and so would a check-raise.

 

[tzuriel]

I would bet this on flop to check what's going on. There are slim chances to check it out to the river.

I can get the same information with a check

 

[D0nk3y Hunt3r]

I can get the same information with a check

You can get more information from betting then checking.

 

[eetenor]

Been seriously card dead for about 20 hands in this micro 1.65 MTT. First defendable hand from the BB. 3 other players to the flop which hits me. I check/called flop here but should I be raising? And the A on the turn I figured that hits him when he bets big and he floated something like AK, AQ, AJ. Was there a better way to play this?


NL Holdem $1.50+$0.15 (190.00BB)
HJ (57.1BBs)
CO (33.3BBs)
BTN (78.8BBs) [VPIP: 48.7% | PFR: 25.6% | AGG: 16.2% | Hands: 39]
SB (15BBs)
HERO (52.2BBs)
UTG (74.1BBs) [VPIP: 29.4% | PFR: 23.5% | AGG: 33.3% | Hands: 18]
EP (33.2BBs)
MP (59.5BBs) [VPIP: 41.2% | PFR: 29.4% | AGG: 16.7% | Hands: 17]

Dealt to Hero: T♣ Q♦

UTG Raises To 2.6BBs, EP Folds, MP Calls 2.5BBs, HJ Folds, CO Folds, BTN Calls 2.5BBs, SB Folds, HERO Calls 1.5BBs

Hero SPR on Flop: [4.29 effective]
Flop (11.6BBs): 6♠ 5♥ T♠
HERO Checks, UTG Bets 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 67.6BBs), MP Folds, BTN Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 72.4BBs), HERO Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 45.8BBs)

Turn (23BBs): 6♠ 5♥ T♠ A♦
HERO Checks, UTG Bets 11.5BBs (Rem. Stack: 56.1BBs), BTN Folds, HERO Folds

Spoiler

UTG wins: 23BBs

When we are playing in tournaments stack protection at 52bb's is something we want to be aware of-QToff is a stack loser multiway as we can be dominated so easily by every other players positional ranges-
Not only can we be dominated but if we make a ten like we did how do we get to showdown easily? How do we know it is good even if we hit it?
How do we realize full equity when we are OOP to 3 players? Even if we flop 2 pair it is not that strong vs 3 players ranges--AT 50bb we cannot just stick it all-in on the flop and get value
This hand is a good hand to use Equilab to check the equity vs three ranges and then because we are vs 3 OOP remove at least 25% of that equity to get an idea how weak we are here in this spot by calling.

It is not always an Ace or 66 sometimes TT but it is often has a lot of equity vs our T when it is not an ace.
We have to remember the UTG led flop OOP vs 2 players and you. While you are 50bb eff the BTN was 74bb eff in the best position. UTG will be adapting their range to all those factors so this is not a full range lead for UTG -you have 66 55 TT in your calling range from BB in this spot so does the BTN

 

[spunka]

It is pretty standard to check to the preflop aggressor. Donk betting this hand into 3 opponents would be an overplay, and so would a check-raise.

"
Hero SPR on Flop: [4.29 effective]
Flop (11.6BBs): 6♠ 5♥ T♠
HERO Checks, UTG Bets 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 67.6BBs), MP Folds, BTN Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 72.4BBs), HERO Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 45.8BBs)"

So what you say is that when we check and preflop raiser c-Bet and we sit with Top Pair, on a draw heavy board.... we just call the C-bet ..... gl with that kind of play, you do not know where your toppair stand ........ and you have an option to take the pot down there, poker is an informations game, you do not get any info by calling.

 

[D0nk3y Hunt3r]

Even if we flop 2 pair it is not that strong vs 3 players ranges--AT 50bb we cannot just stick it all-in on the flop and get value

Two pairs are not a weak hand multiway.

 

[makisaa]

You tried your 10Q, and seemed to run good with a ten in the flop, but the turn showed an ace. Your opponent was very enthusiastic there and made a big bet, which means he has something like AK, AQ or a suited AX, or even just AX. There I think it was reasonable your fold to save you stack!

 

[fundiver199]

"
Hero SPR on Flop: [4.29 effective]
Flop (11.6BBs): 6♠ 5♥ T♠
HERO Checks, UTG Bets 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 67.6BBs), MP Folds, BTN Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 72.4BBs), HERO Calls 3.8BBs (Rem. Stack: 45.8BBs)"

So what you say is that when we check and preflop raiser c-Bet and we sit with Top Pair, on a draw heavy board.... we just call the C-bet .....

Yes because if we take an aggression line with this kind of hand multiway against players with strong ranges, we usually get better hands to call or raise and worse hands to fold. So we either win a small pot, when we are ahead or lose a big one, when we are behind. Its true, that we are often going to be in tough spots later, when we check-call the flop in this spot. But thats why we fold preflop

 

[eetenor]

Two pairs are not a weak hand multiway.

"Not that strong "does not mean weak -it does mean that 3 Villains who are IP can have TT QQ KQ QJ AQ AA KK KJ J9 AK AJ bottom set and potential flush draws all of which can become the best hand with two cards to come and are very unlikely to stack off with worse QX or TX so we win a small pot or lose a large pot much more frequently than win stacks- Switch our position to BTN and the relative strength of our hand QToff increases dramatically as we risk losing a big pot much less often- Using Equilab on two pair flops with reasonable ranges for the 3 V will help

 

[D0nk3y Hunt3r]

so we win a small pot or lose a large pot much more frequently than win stacks

This.
However in PLO getting stacked somebody with my two pairs on the flop multiway is a piece of cake.

 

[ratbat615]

I like 👍 the fold so many hands 🙌 beats 🎧 you.