can poker sites manipulate RNG ?

[chronical]

"without any supervising systems" - ? meaning what ?
any/most sites has a RNG CERTIFICATE given out buy othe company if you trust that company (heard/read rewives)
on a technical side - yes you can manipualte code as you like, but the logical question is who whouyld play there?

 

[Igor Popadyk]

it’s like a conspiracy theory, you can believe it or not, although I’m sure that there are super users in some rooms who can manipulate, as for the random number generator, it was said in a broadcast that the distribution and output of cards for poker stars was determined initially, in other rooms by to another

 

[Datdude1]

We are playing online with computers, programs and data scripting our card game. It's possible for the the programs to come up with any outcome they choose.

 

[webstman]

I´m systems and game developer, there can be a manipulation script to privilege some player. I have already done a C # simulation showing the algorithm from the shuffling, distribution, betting, checking of winning hands, pot distribution and so on.

Without the supervision of some serious entity, there is no way to have credibility in the game if there is no way to confirm the smoothness of the game.


For example a simple condition in a script could already manipulate the game favoring a particular player such as for example I will explain below:


We have 4 players on the table, tournament with ID 1234. The names are Eder, Ryan, Mark and Joseph. before starting to distribute the cards the script will check if anyone on the list will benefit.


Not to mention that I already know the order of the cards before hand. There are 52 cards in the deck so I store them in an array of 52 positions.




The first 8 are aimed at the players, the 9 is the first burn, the 10 to the 12 position are the flop. The 13th is the second burning to 14th is the Turn, the 15th is the third burning and the 16th is the River.




With all the advance, without having to PLAY I already know that player X will have the winning hand due to the combination of values. The first player will receive the cards in positions 1 and 5, the second player will receive the cards 2 and 6, the third player will receive the cards 3 and 7 and finally the fourth player will receive the cards 4 and 8.




Where would the manipulation go? Think of it this way, the first 8 cards would be:


1 - 2h
2 - As
3 - 5d
4- 8c
5 - 3h
6 - Ad
7-Ac
8-Kc


Then we would have:


Player 1: 2h-3h


Player 2 - As-Ad


Player 3 - 5d-Ac


Player 4 - 8c-Kc


cards in sequence in the deck:


9 - 5c (discard)
10 - 5 h (flop)
11-kd (flop)
12 - 4h (flop)
13 - 9c (discard)
14 - 7d (turn)
15 - 6 h (discard)
16 - 7c (River)


in this way you would already know in advance that player 2 would win the hand with a pair of Ace.


But the script will check the condition of the player's name: if (NameOfPlayer == "Eder") Function_Make_the_player_be_victorious();


In this way the function of forging the result where you will invert the cards of positions 15 and 16 enters, causing player 1 to have a Straight Flush of 2 to 6 of hearts.


This is a simple example of how you can have in-game manipulation

I like your explanation. I have been playing hours upon hours at CoinPoker and I know something isn’t right. Some names keep seating at my table ( I labeled them) even if 200 , 300 players or in. ( 0,1 sat 4 player table) and as soon you double up or win 2,3 hands the biggest stack always comes at my left side and e super aggressive always seat before me. Same pattern every time. Player on the left raises almos only my bb. And sold al lot. But when I get a hand (AK or better) after folding a long time he snap calls my 3 bb bet instantly and wins with j5o or 94 hitting a straight. Other times ak and he will turn over aa kk wen you push all in. ( him being the last player wen every one folded. My labeled “friends “ always find me in a 4 player table no matter how much or in the game. lol

 

[webstman]

This should be in the Rigtards Thread!
Why would sites rig anything. Their take comes from the rake.

You answer says a lot about you! 😉

 

[OnyxD]

Technically that's possible. Like any piece of software could be "tweaked", unless the site somehow doesn't have access to the code which I doubt is the case. Big sites might not be incentivized to do this (hopefully), but smaller/newer rooms may. Like if they populate their games with bots, they wouldn't want their bots losing a lot of money to good players, it's not a charity operation. I've recently read a case like that about Nuts Poker (plyers' suspicions, not proven.)

Also, there is a good post above about not 100% randomness. Years ago I read a huge thread on pokerstrategy about losing EV from how RNG operated at major sites. Basically, the OP didn't get the strong hole cards, the draws didn't close etc. as much as they mathematically should have over tens of thousands of hands. Once again it makes sense for rooms to prevent sharks from maximizing their profits. Not sure if I could post links to other forums here. If I happen to find it, I will drop it here.

 

[OnyxD]

I like your explanation. I have been playing hours upon hours at CoinPoker and I know something isn’t right. Some names keep seating at my table ( I labeled them) even if 200 , 300 players or in. ( 0,1 sat 4 player table) and as soon you double up or win 2,3 hands the biggest stack always comes at my left side and e super aggressive always seat before me. Same pattern every time. Player on the left raises almos only my bb. And sold al lot. But when I get a hand (AK or better) after folding a long time he snap calls my 3 bb bet instantly and wins with j5o or 94 hitting a straight. Other times ak and he will turn over aa kk wen you push all in. ( him being the last player wen every one folded. My labeled “friends “ always find me in a 4 player table no matter how much or in the game. lol

Oh man, as I read the title of the thread, Coinpoker was the first (and only) that came to mind. I didn't get nearly as many crazy bad beats as there, while literally playing at a number of rooms at the same time. Coinpoker has the craziest variance. Most amount of two-street 'luck' I have seen. I am actually usually anti-conspirancy and all, so I will keep watching. Might be just a streak, who knows, but I am alert. It's not the players, as I play to worse/looser players with just as crazy play styles at other rooms. I'm assuming you played cash?

And the fact it's a crypto company only amplifies the caution.

 

[OnyxD]

I like your explanation. I have been playing hours upon hours at CoinPoker and I know something isn’t right. Some names keep seating at my table ( I labeled them) even if 200 , 300 players or in. ( 0,1 sat 4 player table) and as soon you double up or win 2,3 hands the biggest stack always comes at my left side and e super aggressive always seat before me. Same pattern every time. Player on the left raises almos only my bb. And sold al lot. But when I get a hand (AK or better) after folding a long time he snap calls my 3 bb bet instantly and wins with j5o or 94 hitting a straight. Other times ak and he will turn over aa kk wen you push all in. ( him being the last player wen every one folded. My labeled “friends “ always find me in a 4 player table no matter how much or in the game. lol

As a followup, Coinpoker has an RNG validation feature that a player can participate in, nothing like any other room I know. But I struggle to make it useful in terms of checking what I was talking about earlier. Here's the link to it:

Validation Tools - CoinPoker

Ensure the fairness of your games with CoinPoker's validation tools. Our transparent technology guarantees a fair play environment for all users.

coinpoker.com