Las Vegas shooting:64 year old Gunman Stephen Paddock kills over 50 people

[belladonna05]

Allegedly. There are way to many inconsistencies in the whole scenario. I do not buy the way they have presented this at all. It is like all the other crazy stories about mass shootings that have happened in the past 20 years or so. Very little proof and a bunch of conjecture, sprinkled with lies and innuendo.

First of all, just ask yourself, what the hell did he need so many guns for and why did it take so long for the police to show up and where are all the spent casings, they show pictures of that room, did you see a pile of spent casings or any burns on the carpet? How was he able to put a video camera up without the casino noticing? Just exactly how did he get all those guns in his room without someone seeing it or suspecting anything?

Nothing adds up.

I'm sure there is a conspiracy thread somewhere you can go post this in.

 

[PokerPete]

Allegedly. There are way to many inconsistencies in the whole scenario. I do not buy the way they have presented this at all. It is like all the other crazy accurate stories about mass shootings that have happened in the past 20 years or so. Very little proof and a bunch of conjecture, sprinkled with lies and innuendo solid evidence backed by forensics and attested to by numerous dead bodies.

FYP.

First of all, just ask yourself, what the hell did he need so many guns for
"Because he can"
and why did it take so long for the police to show up
"Gee, a single room in a massive hotel - no idea why it would take time at all"
and where are all the spent casings, they show pictures of that room, did you see a pile of spent casings or any burns on the carpet?
Huh, didn't realize you were present in the room...are you a co-conspirator?

How was he able to put a video camera up without the casino noticing?
Really...It's not like this fancy sci-fi product is readily available to average everyday folks battery operated wireless camera, about the size of an egg, which mounts in under a sec using self adhesive magnetic mounts
oh...wait...
Just exactly how did he get all those guns in his room without someone seeing it or suspecting anything?
Gee...guy checks into a hotel with 10 suitcases very suspicious indeed!
Nothing adds up....if you close your eyes to the obvious

I'm sure there is a conspiracy thread somewhere you can go post this in.

Not so sure, this one doesn't even rise to the quality of the ChemTrailers and 9/11 truthers...

 

[belladonna05]

FYP.




Not so sure, this one doesn't even rise to the quality of the ChemTrailers and 9/11 truthers...

You and I are getting extra salty in our old age, ie no time for bs?
Also there are Sandy Hook truthers who have harrassed the parents of the children murdered there, I despise seeing someone else already starting it up.

 

[PokerPete]

You and I are getting extra salty in our old age, ie no time for bs?

...in the business world, they have a term for this:

Spoiler

"experience"

 

[Propane Goat]

First of all, just ask yourself, what the hell did he need so many guns for and why did it take so long for the police to show up and where are all the spent casings, they show pictures of that room, did you see a pile of spent casings or any burns on the carpet? How was he able to put a video camera up without the casino noticing? Just exactly how did he get all those guns in his room without someone seeing it or suspecting anything?

Nothing adds up.

Nothing in your post adds up, I think you've been watching too many movies.

Firing a rifle out of a broken window isn't going to leave burns on the carpet :rofl:, shell casings are going to be ejected sideways so if he was standing/laying close enough from the window to be able to achieve the downward angle that he needed, you're not going to see shell casings strewn around the entire room. A lot of them would have probably been ejected out the window.

How did he get all those guns up there....hmm, maybe haul one or two suitcases at a time in 30-60 minute intervals? What's suspicious about somebody carrying luggage into a hotel in one of the largest tourist destinations in the world? What did he need so many guns for......I think we found out why.

 

[fletchdad]

Allegedly. There are way to many inconsistencies in the whole scenario. I do not buy the way they have presented this at all. It is like all the other crazy stories about mass shootings that have happened in the past 20 years or so. Very little proof and a bunch of conjecture, sprinkled with lies and innuendo.

First of all, just ask yourself, what the hell did he need so many guns for and why did it take so long for the police to show up and where are all the spent casings, they show pictures of that room, did you see a pile of spent casings or any burns on the carpet? How was he able to put a video camera up without the casino noticing? Just exactly how did he get all those guns in his room without someone seeing it or suspecting anything?

Nothing adds up.

Please, just dont.................

 

[WVHillbilly]

What, you mean you guys don't know about how this was just a false flag event paid for by George Soros to justify taking your guns? I saw it on Facebook so I know it's true. Multiple alt-right websites have confirmed it.

BTW spewing shit like the above is just fine but talking about any sort of gun-control is disrespectful to the victims.

 

[Zorba]

Nothing adds up.

Too much fap fap fap will do that.

[emoji106]

 

[rifflemao]

I'm sure there is a conspiracy thread somewhere you can go post this in.

He has also said 9/11 was all a magic trick.

 

[Debi]

It's inappropriate and too soon to discuss any gun reforms in response to Sunday’s attack in Las Vegas. The pro-poker-player that was there, went to get his gun, in supporting the cops.
What we know, that is Isis claims it's behind the attack!
2nd His GF is now wanted by the FBI, Since explosives were found in the house. https://www.yahoo.com/gma/las-vegas...irlfriend-210205905--abc-news-topstories.html

P.S Bell, he played poker, at $100 a hand!

Inappropriate - or inconvenient for those of you who don't support it?

It is definitely appropriate - and it is too late not too soon. What is inappropriate is people like you using this tragedy to sweep the issue under the carpet.

 

[rifflemao]

http://soundcloud.com/pbsnewshour/amendments-for-background

Found this 4 year old podcast about gun reform legislation failing after the Aurora and Sandy Hook massacres, with Gwen Ifill who is no longer with us.

It's eerie to listen to these older reports, because someone inevitably said what we all knew then, that more attacks will happen. It makes me wonder how many of the LV victims watched the news coverage of Aurora, Newtown, San Bernadino, Orlando, Las Vegas, and all the others in between, and literally heard a frustrated news guest predict their deaths.

Luckily, the data says that in the big picture these attacks are a very small part of the gun crime problem in the US. Whew...for a minute I was getting worried.

 

[Zorba]

Inappropriate - or inconvenient for those of you who don't support it?

It is definitely appropriate

Spot on, this is how the community here came together to rid ourselves of the inappropriate firearms and magazines and in the case of the USA the other inappropriate accessories like bump stocks.

Your country's citizens in plain terms need to wake up to themselves and realise that these massacres will not stop until action is taken, look at how easy drumph got into office by the people with the same mentality that got him elected, imagine what the people with the same gun control mentality can do.

It will be a big job but it needs to be done.

The question now is, Are the people strong enough to take a stand for gun control.

:dontknow:

 

[fletchdad]

The question now is, Are the people strong enough to take a stand for gun control.

:dontknow:

There are many people strong enough, brave enough, loud enough (choose your adjective..) to take a stand, and many are and have been. Many more are being active and vocal now more than ever (even though that is always the case immediately after a tragedy).

The problem(s) is very deeply rooted in the American culture and will not be easy to change. If - and hopefully when - it does change, it will be a very long and arduous process.

One of the major problems is the attitude: "If guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have guns". This is also sadly a legitimate point, in that there are so many guns, even if there was never another one sold, and all "good" citizens gave up all their weapons, the amount of guns still available would be a staggering amount indeed...... The situation has been allowed to mutate to the stage where there is no way to control who has what, and banning or limiting availability will not show any significant reduction in violent guns usage for a very long time.

Good people are afraid to not have guns because so many bad people do. This, sadly, can be a very legitimate fear, depending on where you live. And exactly this fear is going to be one of the hardest obstacles to overcome, (even among people who actually have no reason to fear), because the NRA, et al ad nauseam, will continue to abuse this fear, and many people do not realize the manipulation, nor do they understand the need to resist such.

So, yes, there are many who are standing up as I type this, but that is - as the Germans say - only a small drop on a hot stone....

 

[kidkvno1]

Inappropriate - or inconvenient for those of you who don't support it?

It is definitely appropriate - and it is too late not too soon. What is inappropriate is people like you using this tragedy to sweep the issue under the carpet.

It is, inappropriate to discuss it in this thread. The bump stocks are going to be banned.

How, did it go from 2 bump stocks, to 12 bump stocks??


I'm not, willing to sweep it under the carpet.

Why are there no red flags on anyone who buys that many guns in that short of a time, or gun ammo
If I get into hunting, there is noway I would need 500+ rounds of ammo..

If you really think about it, I would only need 25 rounds, unless I'm shooting some birds for dinner. Even just shooting for fun, I would not burn up 100 rounds.

I'm going to post 2 links, you can make your own call on them.
http://headlinehealth.com/mainstream-media-ignores-shooters-valium-use/?AID=7236
http://www.benzo.org.uk/index.htm

 

[PokerPete]

One of the major problems is the attitude: "If guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have guns". This is also sadly a legitimate point, in that there are so many guns, even if there was never another one sold, and all "good" citizens gave up all their weapons, the amount of guns still available would be a staggering amount indeed...... The situation has been allowed to mutate to the stage where there is no way to control who has what, and banning or limiting availability will not show any significant reduction in violent guns usage for a very long time.

Actually no. The outlaws with guns got them one of two ways:
legal purchases and illegal purchases

Guns come from one source: legal manufacturing

The number of illegal guns seized is staggering. Nearly as staggering as the
number of guns legally purchased and then either stolen or resold illegally.

Stopping the legal gun sales without requiring current owners to surrender them would result in higher
black market prices as illegal guns are seized and fewer are available to steal or resell illegally.

How, did it go from 2 bump stocks, to 12 bump stocks??

What are you talking about?
Real media had the number at 12 since the Vegas police said 12.

 

[kidkvno1]

Bump stocks, are going to be banned in PA. No one in PA can have a bump stock.

What are you talking about?
Real media had the number at 12 since the Vegas police said 12.

I'm talking about the real media, a few days afterwards, it was at 2 unless it was a type-o..

 

[PokerPete]

I'm talking about the real media, a few days afterwards, it was at 2 unless it was a type-o..

Like I said, the real media had the number at 12 since the Vegas police described what they found and said 12.

Bump stocks, are going to be banned in PA. No one in PA can have a bump stock.

...unfortunately, it will probably be a myopic ban. They should do a generic ban on any
device that alters the human involved action required to operate a semi-auto as designed.
Meaning: no cranks, fancy "gloves", etc. etc.

 

[Zorba]

There are many people strong enough, brave enough, loud enough (choose your adjective..) to take a stand, and many are and have been. Many more are being active and vocal now more than ever (even though that is always the case immediately after a tragedy).

The problem(s) is very deeply rooted in the American culture and will not be easy to change. If - and hopefully when - it does change, it will be a very long and arduous process.

One of the major problems is the attitude: "If guns are outlawed, then only outlaws will have guns". This is also sadly a legitimate point, in that there are so many guns, even if there was never another one sold, and all "good" citizens gave up all their weapons, the amount of guns still available would be a staggering amount indeed...... The situation has been allowed to mutate to the stage where there is no way to control who has what, and banning or limiting availability will not show any significant reduction in violent guns usage for a very long time.

Good people are afraid to not have guns because so many bad people do. This, sadly, can be a very legitimate fear, depending on where you live. And exactly this fear is going to be one of the hardest obstacles to overcome, (even among people who actually have no reason to fear), because the NRA, et al ad nauseam, will continue to abuse this fear, and many people do not realize the manipulation, nor do they understand the need to resist such.

So, yes, there are many who are standing up as I type this, but that is - as the Germans say - only a small drop on a hot stone....

That's why I said it will be a big job, but it has to start somewhere, take the trump phenomenon, his support kept growing and growing as the support for gun control can, it will take a very long time due to the number of firearms out there.

I don't know how bad the outlaw situation is in the US but my answer may be simple but it is people shouldn't associate with outlaws and they'll be safe, do outlaws go out hunting the common man, these outlaws will eventually be caught and hopefully have their weapons seized.

This constant talk of having to defend oneself doesn't give a lot of confidence to someone that hasn't been to the US to want to visit, then add in the drive by shooting and a police shooting of my countrymen recently while minding their own business and waiting for police assistance that they called for.

Actually no. The outlaws with guns got them one of two ways:
legal purchases and illegal purchases

Guns come from one source: legal manufacturing

The number of illegal guns seized is staggering. Nearly as staggering as the
number of guns legally purchased and then either stolen or resold illegally.

Stopping the legal gun sales without requiring current owners to surrender them would result in higher
black market prices as illegal guns are seized and fewer are available to steal or resell illegally.

Do the seized firearms get destroyed or would that be anathema in the US and they get sold at government or police auctions.

1 thing about the black market prices going up that can be looked at as a positive is that they will be harder to obtain, only cashed up rednecks will be able to afford them, they won't be on the streets for $10 as they probably are now that any moron can afford.

What are you talking about?
Real media had the number at 12 since the Vegas police said 12.

Maybe he should be asking, How the hell were bump stocks ever allowed to be sold in the first place, who is the sick bastard that allowed these to be able to be sold to the public, I can see a valid military use, but really wtf Why were they sold to the public?

 

[rifflemao]

I'm posting this here not because I support it, but because I wonder what the counterarguments are. Fwiw, I'm for trying something like Australia has done.

One thing that strikes me is he says we have about 325 million guns in the US, and that even if the Australian plan worked to perfection here, we'd still be left with 200 million guns. Am I missing something, or wouldn't taking 38% of guns (of the deadliest design) be a damned good start?

Let me know if you find something wrong in his argument. Being on Prager U, he's obviously being paid to argue against gun control.

 

[Zorba]

Im mobile at thw moment and didn't look at the video, is that in the first year, if so it's a bloody good start.

As I've said before we still have firearms available to us, and they can still kill people but the majority of the people aren't shit scared of being shot by each other, and the possibility of someone having a pistol concealed is virtually non existent, and if it is it will most likely just get waved around and not used, only time we hear of the occasional shootings is rival drug dealers and bike club members shooting each other, and domestic disputes.

Thats why I also say about outlaws with firearms and not associating with them.

[emoji106]

 

[fletchdad]

I don't know how bad the outlaw situation is in the US but my answer may be simple but it is people shouldn't associate with outlaws and they'll be safe, do outlaws go out hunting the common man, these outlaws will eventually be caught and hopefully have their weapons seized.

The point I was making is not the number of outlaws, but the attitude people have that if you take their guns, they will either be defenceless against the people who have guns or technically be outlaws themselves if they decide to not give up their weapons. It is the fear factor I was alluding to. It is also a cop-out for gun owners. The "If guns are outlawed, only..." thing used to be a popular bumper sticker on NRA members and supporters cars, as well as a slogan to let people know that they MUST fear changes in the gun culture.

There are other points I would like to touch on as well, but am pressed for time ATM. But, yes. people see the news and are trepidatious about a trip to the US if they have never been.... Or sometimes exactly because they HAVE been. But that is, thankfully, the exception.

 

[kidkvno1]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/hotel-questions-revised-timeline-las-vegas-massacre-073050283.html
If that's true, the hotel and the LVPD is at fault for not getting on it quicker..

Like I said, the real media had the number at 12 since the Vegas police described what they found and said 12.


...unfortunately, it will probably be a myopic ban. They should do a generic ban on any
device that alters the human involved action required to operate a semi-auto as designed.
Meaning: no cranks, fancy "gloves", etc. etc.

I went looking in the news reports, that I booked marked and the did an edit to the news report.
It will be a full out ban..

PA law on machine guns.
http://smartgunlaws.org/machine-gunsautomatic-firearms-in-pennsylvania/

Last updated September 30, 2016.
Pennsylvania law prohibits the possession of machine guns, unless the machine gun was registered under the National Firearms Act, or falls within some other exception.1 Note that the National Firearms Act generally allows private citizens to register and possess machine guns so long as they were manufactured prior to May 19, 1986, and are not prohibited by state or local law.

 

[Zorba]

After watching the video I noticed that he keep saying confiscation, and he said firearms were banned here, but they aren't, that's the lawyer speaking, what he needs to speak as, is a human being, it isn't confiscation when it is handed in voluntarily, when people start wanting to remove the inappropriate weapons more and more will be off the street then hopefully the rest will get confiscated when discovered by the authorities, the sound of rapid fire with or with high cap mags isn't mistakable, people have to become pro active and report what they hear and see and not leave it to just the authorities to find them. The idiots that you really don't want to have those types of weapons won't be able to help themselves, the need to show them off or shoot beer cans is irresistible to them.

The point I was making is not the number of outlaws, but the attitude people have that if you take their guns, they will either be defenceless against the people who have guns or technically be outlaws themselves if they decide to not give up their weapons. It is the fear factor I was alluding to. It is also a cop-out for gun owners. The "If guns are outlawed, only..." thing used to be a popular bumper sticker on NRA members and supporters cars, as well as a slogan to let people know that they MUST fear changes in the gun culture.

There are other points I would like to touch on as well, but am pressed for time ATM. But, yes. people see the news and are trepidatious about a trip to the US if they have never been.... Or sometimes exactly because they HAVE been. But that is, thankfully, the exception.

I know that fear and how the NRA are, they came here when gun control was being discussed and they used the same argument to stir up the nutters, and that brings me back to should I fear going to the US, I imagine most rural places would be safe but if the locals fear being shot then I should be shit scared, if I go almost anywhere here I don't have that fear. (exceptions would be things like climbing over the back fence of a bike club at night, make that anytime of the day )


Maybe an "ENOUGH is ENOUGH fight for gun control" bumper sticker is needed, hopefully people will start to realise that enough is enough, it's time to act like grown ups and talk instead of draw.

It will be a huge job but it has to start somewhere and that somewhere is the people wanting to, more than wanting to cling to the 2nd.

 

[PokerPete]

I went looking in the news reports, that I booked marked and the did an edit to the news report.
It will be a full out ban..

PA law on machine guns.
http://smartgunlaws.org/machine-gunsautomatic-firearms-in-pennsylvania/

That's the existing law under which "Bump stocks" are technically legal in PA

The Dem introduced:
http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs...blic.cfm?chamber=H&SPick=20170&cosponId=24683

In the near future we plan to introduce legislation that updates the state’s definition of “offensive weapons” to include “multiburst trigger activators.”

The Pennsylvania crimes code currently bans “offensive weapons,” which includes items such as machine guns, sawed-off shotguns, and grenades. Violation of this section carries a penalty of a first degree misdemeanor.

This legislation would include “multiburst trigger activators” to the list of offensive weapons and includes items such as binary triggers and slide fire/bump stocks—like the one used in the Las Vegas shooting.

These firearm modifications are described as being able to simulate fully automatic rates of fire, and able to expel over 600 rounds per minute—more than 9 rounds per second. To see the speed at which these weapons can fire, please see this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VJ1Xt3OzipA

Please join us in co-sponsoring legislation to ban deadly tools that have no place in civilian society.

meanwhile:
http://www.mcall.com/news/nationwor...mp-stock-pennsylvania-ban-20171007-story.html

Pat Browne, R-Lehigh, sent a proposal asking senators to support a bill banning the sale, import, manufacture and possession of bump stocks in Pennsylvania. He wrote his proposal a day after two House Democrats offered bills in their chamber to ban the same device.

I can't find the actual his proposal but it sounds like it's limited to just bump stocks.

 

[Trillian]

Maybe he should be asking, How the hell were bump stocks ever allowed to be sold in the first place, who is the sick bastard that allowed these to be able to be sold to the public, I can see a valid military use, but really wtf Why were they sold to the public?

I don't even see a military use. Why use a conversion from semi-auto to auto, when you can purchase fully auto? Imho the only purpose of bump stocks is to circumvent gun laws.

I don't understand why people get so mad when even regulation is mentioned. It's said we have some of the toughest regulations here in germany but still it is possible to get guns for those, who are in need or want to play safely.