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Message: [QUOTE="300HPGOD, post: 6525667, member: 305911"] Pre: I am on team 3 bet here pre. I read your post and I get the mixing but this deep I think we should be 3 betting here. I dont want to get squeezed although its not the end but you could have got squeezed being out of position which is not favorable, at least in this case we were in position. Being in position with JJ even against a tight player (after 20 anyway) should be a spot we envy. After the 3 bet by BB I totally agree to just flat here after MP flats. Depending on MP they could just flat here with AA and KK and I take out QQ. Flop: These are the spots that I hate and I know I overfold. Two diamonds and low cards on the board. BB leads out 40% ish which is a little small for 2 diamonds but its not that small. Meaning I think they could easily have a big pocket pair here and bet this way especially if they have a diamond. MP's raise is interesting since are they overcalling pre flop with 22 ,33 or even 77 with us still to act pre behind them? I wouldnt think so, so I doubt this is a set. This feels like a big draw like AK or AQ of diamonds which could easily overcall the pre flop 3 bet. I think 1010 and 99 could get to this point and be in a tough spot (like we are) but I feel like they might just jam here if they are going to do anything. I know that doesnt make sense either but their raise they make is approaching half of the effective stack to them (what we have left) so why wouldnt they just bomb it then compared to getting called and then never folding after that no matter what? I guess you could say the same for a draw as well which makes this spot puzzling since MP is never folding without seeing all the cards come out after making this bet. We are behind AK or AQ of diamonds and of course crushing 1010. We are only slightly behind the big draws. Slight chance as mentioned they slowplayed pre with AA or KK. That is only MP, we still have BB to worry about who I dont think is light just because of their bet sizing on the flop but feel its close to normal sizing and they could have QQ+ since we dont know their 3 bet range yet due to 20 hands on them. There are scenarios here where we could come up with that pot odds are right to jam (never calling here, jam or fold which I know you already know). I dont think we are ever getting it in as a fav unless MP does this with 1010 and BB just folds which I believe is rare. I think everyone sees this to the end as BB is rarely if ever folding an overpair so I dont like jamming it here so I fold. As I mentioned I probably overfold here in these spots but this is early and unless we know these players to be high variance players (and we dont know that here) then we should assume at least someone is near the top of their range here or at least is a fav drawing against us. I fold and say "this sucks" but I do fold and move on. [/QUOTE]

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