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Message: [QUOTE="colin_147, post: 366724, member: 3650"] I dont really know what you mean here Rob. Situation. 10 players = 20 cards dealt, that leave 32 cards in the deck. Say SB call and BB checks, eveyone else folds. Flop comes. That leaves 29 cards in the deck. Now assuming you are calculating your outs and are on a 4 flush spade draw, you have 9 outs for instance with 29 cards in the deck. You must assume 9 of those cards are spades ( so in that sense yes you are correct, you can only discount cards you have seen, but you will not see any of the folded hands, so its impossible to discount any cards) [/QUOTE]